[00:00:27] Jay: Hi everyone. Welcome to The First Customer podcast. My name's Jay Aigner. Today. I am lucky enough to have a very, very special guest. The special, the most special guest that we've ever had, Chris Wink,

[00:00:38] Chris: Stop trolling me, Jay.

[00:00:40] Jay: CEO and co founder of Technical.ly founder of Philly Tech Week. And for those who don't know, Technical.ly from the horse's mouth. Is a news organization with a community of technologists and entrepreneurs. I think it's a very nice way to say digital newspaper. I'm gonna read a quote though. I've never done this, but

I saw this and it really, punctuated my thoughts of Chris. This is from Lancey Sylvia on your LinkedIn.

[00:01:09] Chris: a throwback.

[00:01:10] Jay: Chris Wink is one of the city's brightest stars. He's intelligent, empathetic, and action oriented. A perfect combination for getting things done in Philly. Chris, welcome to the show, my friend. How are you?

[00:01:24] Chris: Hey, thanks. I wonder how many of your listeners you already lost by, 

[00:01:27] Jay: They didn't even show up. So it's good. Just me and you talking. It's fine. Nobody listens to these anyway. What's up, man? How are you, buddy?

Thanks for being on. 

[00:01:33] Chris: I am well, thank you for the opportunity. I love to have a conversation with a friend about the work that we do.

[00:01:40] Jay: Yes. And, you do a million things, but I'm genuinely interested. I mean, I was going back through your LinkedIn stuff and looking at your history and where you came from and all these different things, so, where are you from? Where did you grow up and did that have any impact on you being an entrepreneur? I

[00:01:57] Chris: I'm sure of it. Wherever we are from in the past shapes who we are today. So I'd have to think that's the case. I grew up in a surprisingly rural corner of Northwest New Jersey. New Jersey does have it's. rural beauty. I grew up in a small town and that means both. I, was probably exposed to a lot less.

you know, I had no, like, you know, entrepreneur clubs or robotics clubs type stuff growing up. So I think I had probably less programming growing up. That meant I missed out on being exposed to that early. I don't come, I don't come from an entrepreneurial family. I don't come from a family of people who were in or around technologies.

So that's not really, anything that, was in my experience, but, I think probably there's an element of service perhaps that runs through, that is certainly something that always. Has been in my head and really I more properly think what I was introduced to without realizing it was a foundation that got me into journalism.

My parents had no journalism background either, but my mother was a teacher, 

[00:03:11] Jay: knew you were going to say it. I knew you were going to say teacher. I knew it. I knew it. We have so many entrepreneurs have teachers as parents. I swear there has to be some connection has to do. 

[00:03:22] Chris: I didn't know that. 

[00:03:24] Jay: 70%, I would say the ones of these 150 episodes, it is a strikingly large number.

So I would love to, do you think. I mean, what did that look like at home? Like, did it did you have some higher bar of, like, academics that you had to go for? Were you more kind of, like, driven through education? Did you have a higher appreciation? I mean, I know we're not all, like, super appreciative of the things our parents did when we were kids.

[00:03:49] Chris: Like, we didn't really understand what was going on. But looking back, do you think by osmosis, there was some sort of, like, goal oriented kind of academic education stuff that was instilled in you through your mom as a teacher? I think with literature, so it's more, I think, writing and reading, probably was more the connection. math and sciences were, less. My mother was, like an elementary school teacher. So it wasn't specialized. Yeah, I, often think my, Journalistic background comes from a mix of my dad can talk to anyone.

And my mom loved questions. So I think put those two things together and though I didn't have the language for it when I was growing up. So it got me into journalism. I think my entrepreneurship career is a, messier stumblier thing. Introduction to service is probably somewhere the keystone that has formed that.

[00:04:51] Jay: Got it. And what, did journalism look like for you when you were kind of growing up and you were going to school and going to college? And were you like, I'm going to go be a journalist? Was that your goal?

[00:05:05] Chris: Not at all in the similar spirit, looking back my high school. None of my schools had like school papers or anything like that. So I think that's something that I, missed that opportunity being at pretty small schools. I actually have this fuzzy memory that I think is true that I had an English teacher in high school say to me, you would have really benefited from a school paper.

And I remember being like, not really getting what that meant. Like I knew what a newspaper was, but I don't think I really got. And I hope that's not anachronistic. I think it happened. but it stayed with. Me that college, I came, I went to Temple university in Philadelphia and, the true and genuine story is I first few weeks was getting into some trouble with pranks and stuff around the dormitory.

And I had a, 22 year old resident assistant who said, you need to get a hobby, bud, or you're going to get yourself in some trouble. And he was active in the college newspaper. I didn't even know it was a thing. He invited me over to the college newspaper and. It clicked. I thought it was like such a cool group of nerds and I thought the vibe was, dope.

So it was very much Temple University and going to a big school that exposed me that, Oh wow, actually our college and paper covers important and interesting stuff. That lit me up. I was interested in writing and Literature in high school or even farther back, but I didn't have the application of journalism was not something I was exposed to.

It was a small newspaper in my town and that mattered, but I don't think I had all the language for it yet. And my parents didn't have that language to give me either.

[00:06:36] Jay: And what, like, what stories or types of stories in a college newspaper did you find to be, you know, Genuinely interesting or generally appealing to a college crowd. It's a very specific, like weird band of time of like 18 to 22 year olds or whatever the number is. But like, what was, hot back then?

Like what actually got people to pick it up and read it?

[00:07:06] Chris: Yeah. I mean, I'm probably somewhere in me, a real advocate nerd at a student media generally because, The incredible learning places, whether or not you care about journalism, it's just, great to think about how information is processed. And, you know, to, our purposes, it is a product and media is complicated.

It's double sided marketplace for, so I think any kind of business. Nerd. I think that's why business and tech people are obsessed with media. They're obsessed with podcasts and, websites and series. And they all have criticisms and thoughts about media and journalism. I think it's inherent because the media business model is complicated.

It's double sided market. Place it's it has prestige to it, but it has very difficult unit economics. There's a lot of stuff that I think people love. so I think student media is powerful because it's a really great learning lab for people, a lot of different experiences. you know, marketing early web trends.

Like there's so many things that it can intersect with anyway. I was in, undergrad and kind of like mid to late two thousands. and. I, have a very vivid memory of kind of like one of the first stories that I was assigned this must have been, you know, 2005 ish in Pennsylvania where, you know, Temple universities, Philadelphia in Pennsylvania, there was, kind of a, what was then called a legislative pay raise scandal.

But basically, looking back, it's a little bit of a gotcha report if you ask me, but there, Literally, in an overnight session, state legislators voted a relatively large pay raise for themselves, whether or not you think it's good doesn't matter. We, at the Student Newspaper, had the clever idea to find everyone who had voted down a recent appropriations for Temple University and other state schools, but who voted up their pay raise.

And so we kind of called them, all those state legislators, and asked, you know, why did you vote for them? This, but not for this higher ed appropriations and several of them called me back and I can still remember being 18 years old being like, why is a state legislator calling me back? And I think I went into that story thinking we were playing a game.

And I think I can, I have this kind of memory of sitting in the junior paper on the phone with like, Oh my God, this person called me back and I'm talking to them and I'm interviewing them. What is happening? And I think in that moment, my heart grew three, two, you know, two, three sizes in the Grinch sense that, Oh, this is important.

and other people think it's important because somewhere in our ethos, we believe information needs to be truer than it Starts out as, and that inspired me and lit something up for me. And I think from that moment on, I took a much deeper responsibility and identity to what that meant about trying to get information out.

And so that was

something that lit me up, but also I saw students care about it too.

[00:10:06] Jay: No, I love that. I think that answers the question. uh. With a nice,

blanket around it. It was like enough. It was, more information than I asked, but it was still all relevant. I feel like that's you in a nutshell. so, let's, fast forward a little bit. let's, get to where you start to think about. Your own thing, you know, where were you. Mindset wise, where are you physically? Where were you? You know, career wise, why did you start to think that spinning off your own digital Technic, you know, technology news outlet was a good idea? 

[00:10:42] Chris: I think of entrepreneurship as applied risk. so I don't think Technical.ly's origin story is as entrepreneurial as it's given credit. I think later on, I think we took some very real risk. We start Technical.ly, two friends and I start, well, two friends and I start a domain called Technicallyphilly. com because it was late 2008, early 2009.

still kind of just coming out of the great recession. We thought we were going to get newspaper jobs. And so we were at the, we were some of the last dummies knocking on the door of newspapers after the great recession. And these two friends and I both were beginning to understand that we may have made a terrible career choice.

and. So what started as Technical.ly. com was very much in a kind of act of desperation, that we didn't have a lot to lose. So it's charming. You know, the three of us really did set up a domain. the editorial coverage was, really the mix of the three of us. I was interested in, policy and business, I guess you would say, like of under.

Brian was interested in really like design and the community of technologists, though I don't think we were using the word yet. And our other friend, Sean had more pure tech interests. So the kind of like tech meets community meets business policy really was the three of us had just like our interest in the Venn diagram is what Technical.ly is earliest coverage was.

but as three of us talk about, we weren't risking a lot. So like, though, that's a nice creation myth of Technical.ly, I think there were times when we made some realer risks when we actually had something to lose, but at the earliest days. We were, we had no money. I was landscaping and doing plumbing jobs and we were going to events with steno pads, trying to start any kind of audience when we had very little option.

[00:12:51] Jay: like you're shortchanging yourself, man. I don't know if maybe there's this, bigger, You know, maybe other people see it as like, you feel like they're giving you too much credit for, you know, the risk that you took, but like It's also like the Mental capacity and emotional dedication to something, right?

I mean, like you guys, you had something that you were building, which is really the core of entrepreneurialism. Even if you take the risks away, like you're building something and like, you built this business. And like, yeah, you're doing other stuff, but like, you still kind of kept enough focus on the prize, all three of you somehow, as you're doing other stuff to survive and pay the bills, to like, make it last.

So I, I think that's a, fairly common origin story. It's not always like, You know, and you know, this there's, it's not always like going to some VC firm and like convincing them that you're going to build the next greatest thing. And it's not like starting a services company where you can start making money on the jump because you're providing pressure professional services, but you did take a risk.

I mean, you mentally tied yourself to this star and didn't know where it was going to go, but like you had this passion for this thing and not a lot of people get to do that. So I think that's a very, it is a, It's more endearing and it is, a charming story,

[00:14:15] Chris: Oh, it's charming. Like that actually, I think is it's 

[00:14:18] Jay: think it's charming, but I also think it's grounded in a little more entrepreneurial ism than you're giving yourself credit for.

Maybe I don't know the ins and outs of the story, but I

do know that, like, I do want to know what it is today. And to get there from where you came, you had to have some sort of Dedication to what it is you were doing, right? Like you believed in it enough. And it's like the belief that you can make this thing happen and work, even when you're doing landscaping and plumbing and all this, I mean, it's even more impressive, right?

Cause you could have gone and done that and like make money immediately. But you're like, no, we're going to do this thing that we reallyreally like and are passionate about. And he grew it over the years. So anyway, I don't know the origin story beyond what you just told me, but I do think, Entrepreneurialism comes in so many different flavors and people like to discount their story. Because it's easy. It's, a nobler path to take, but you got to give yourself some credit sometimes, man. I think it was a, it's an interesting start grounded in something you really wanted to do and you stuck it out.

[00:15:12] Chris: I think My point is I also get, when I look back there, there are other decision points when we bet something. 

[00:15:19] Jay: That's fair. 

[00:15:20] Chris: so I think that's why also we encourage people to try companies when they're younger, because that's the, beauty is that you have very little to lose. That's why it's good. I like, the other story that, you know, you and I both know is super common.

Now I can look back and I can see, it's like in, in college, I was literally Like buy in stuff and reselling it around the dorm. And I was cutting haircuts and I was doing haircuts in the bathroom and Saturday mornings, like I wouldn't have had, I wish I could talk to me then, but I don't think I would have described that as entrepreneurial.

Like I think the word that in the last 10 years we've used, it's kind of hustle. I think that is right. Like, and that is, for whatever reason. That was true. I think the, three of us had that we were like, had a personality trait that looking back, we're like, we're going to just go try to figure something out and that I think is very entrepreneurial I also just know we were so desperate, anything was better than what we could do now.

I think there's other times when we had something to lose. And when I like said, no, I'm going to go back into that. I look back and I'm like, that's when I actually became an entrepreneur. When I said, I'm going to, I'm going to put some money back on the table or I'm going to bet on this. I had reputational risk.

I still, I feel like now, and I think a lot of entrepreneurs have that. Like reputational risk is real. And that I think is the obstacle for more people ever doing something entrepreneurial is the reputational risk. When you're 22 and unemployed, it's a great time to start. Cause there's no reputational risk.

I can't fall any, I can't fall any farther.

[00:17:03] Jay: Yeah, but you're also not going out and like, just going to work for somebody else. Like, that's the, I would say that's

[00:17:08] Chris: I couldn't get a job. Jay. I think the point 

[00:17:10] Jay: mean, I think you could have got a job somewhere, right? Like that's the point, right? I mean, if you look at it from a context of somebody who says, I'm too afraid to go out and even try it, right?

And like, that's, I think there's a line there somewhere. And I think, I mean, look through human history and look through the percentage of people who started a business versus just the people who go do. Normal nine to five jobs, nothing against that at all. But like, it's a very, very, very, very small percentage of people who have done that.

So like that in and of itself, and yes, have you matured your entrepreneurial spirit and taken risks and gone, you know, do all these things. I totally agree with, but I, you know, I do think that, just the dedication to really stick with something that, like I said, you could have done whatever you're doing full time on the side.

[00:17:54] Chris: I know you want to move on, but let me, you just, what, the one thing that you said that I think is real and interesting that others might identify with, and I don't know if we all do this, but I do a lot of like. Older me, if I was able to talk to younger me. one thing that I think I remember in Dorian, I took very hard.

I think, particularly in my moment in time of my trade of journalism, we got shit talked so much when we were trying to start. What became Technical.ly from other journals that should have been Mentors or supporters that is the thing that I will like I definitely have some like trauma baggage that I will carry forever from people who were to your point just old enough that they got in when they still could get a job and that we were tossed aside as these like Self promoters.

And I think maybe you also feel in my voice where we're like, fuck you guys. Like we wish we could get a fucking job. Are you fucking kidding me? We like, this is the only option we fucking have. We are paddling as fast as we can to survive. And you're saying we're self promoting like liver. We got in a, in alt weekly, we got named the In a very tongue in cheek, the biggest self promoters.

And it was like this description of three 23 year olds to the point where the later the editor, I had beers, the editor, like 10 years later, he apologized, cause it was like the biggest dump fest. So I think that was a lot of bravery. I want to give 22, 23 year old us that we were getting shit talked on.

This older tribe of our industry peers, or, that is a trauma. I will never do to another younger person because it was done to me.

[00:19:36] Jay: I think it's a very good point. And I feel like that has to some degree, and I'm sure different industries are completely different, but I do feel like there's a air of giving back from a mentorship perspective that I've seen, at least in the tech space, grow and change over the past 10, 15, 20 years of like, You don't need to be a dick. You don't need to be scared of somebody that's younger and coming up and like, you know, and there's something, there's a, good feeling attached with helping someone else and watching them grow in their own little space that they're in. And like, maybe they're, you know, partner years one day, maybe they're, send you business, but like, who knows?

[00:20:16] Chris: Like, it doesn't matter. It's just like, it's given back. And like, so yes, I think that's a really good point. All right. So you and three guys, you start this little newspaper. Organization, everybody's bashing you and telling you're fucking idiots and to give up and to go jump off the Walt Whitman or whatever. kind of walk me through to, we are now, like, what are the big milestones that you guys hit? What are some of those bigger risks you took? Like how did you take it from that three person org into what it is today? Yeah. So those first couple of years, we're all piecing it together. It's a hobby project that we're doing at night and just truly trying to keep head above water by whatever gig work we can do. And that great recession moment, starts. Improving, you know, there's kind of 2009, 2010, 2011, that, economy starts churning a bit and, that's when I think it starts mattering.

I think by 2011, we'd done a little bit of freelance stuff. We had gotten a little bit of audience growth cause we stuck with it. And I think there was a moment in, that kind of 2011, 2012 period, where we could have all said, all right, this served its purpose. Let's go get our job. We could have, gotten reported jobs then.

And we had started, we had launched failure tech week, which I think looking back, I'm proud of, you know, 24 year old us said, we talked to a lot of different kinds of, we talked to kind of traditional it businesses. We're talking to this like little kind of startupy thing. We're talking to the, talking to these.

Like early meetup culture, we were finding these little groups that all would talk about themselves as being a tech community. And we were talking to people in other cities and finding this was happening elsewhere that, these little sub communities locally all thought they were a tech community.

They also are using that word community. It was like interesting that we were seeing some patterns. but at that point there really was very little intersection between kind of. IT businesses early, this is literally obviously pre kind of Salesforce SaaS, you know, model really popularized, but like there was a kind of software scene happening and early meetup culture.

We were going out to these events and we were becoming a little. They all would read us and we're like, Oh, that's interesting that these little different corners of quote, unquote tech, like we're, a through line for them because we were covering the kids who weren't getting business publication coverage, but we also were, we're being read by some of the, kind of traditional businesses.

So we, Launch affiliate tech week, which was a, I guess, just a very straightforward. We think we're sensible as a news org to get all these different groups to just be united on one front because the trade associations that existed were for pretty traditional it businesses. and we were trying to pull some different groups in together.

We actually like hung out with software developers. Because they were a lot of our peers. And so I think the, thing that we weren't only talking to entrepreneurs, we also were interested in like the people who are building software tech workers, like freelance economy designers that, I think was early on interesting about us, that there was also a worker voice alongside the entrepreneurship voice.

and that's made us unusual.so that I think was important to really tech week was important. You know, we, cause we got probably 20, 000 in, in sponsorships, which was literally like, it was as if we were a billion in there. Like it was the biggest, it was incredible. We got like three, 500 sponsorships.

Oh my God. so, that was meant everything. that was an important stage. that was, it was when friend Sean stepped aside. and I think that's an entrepreneurial moment where Brian, And I said, we, think there is something here and that's when we rebranded to Technical.ly. And so Brian and I said, there, is a, we want to try this.

So I feel like that's a lot of like, that was entrepreneurial that we think there's something here. So we rebranded the Technical.ly we launched, expanded the Baltimore, hired kind of the first couple of non founder people. Got some started selling some sponsorships a little bit advertising started doing more regular events the like, you know in 2010 1112 We're getting thousand dollar Sponsorship here and there to host a happy hour and we do a lot of those and we were basically able to throw a little Party and it was before there were a lot of like regular meetups and we were the meetup especially in Baltimore and Philly We were like early on in that stuff

and that Became and other stuff started spinning out, in, in all, in both these cities, entrepreneur expo at affiliate startup leaders, we work with that early PSL team that happens during tech week for the first time, and stuff splintering out of that.

And that felt very much, and then it became like a national story. The 2010s became a, giant flourishing. and we expand to other cities. We basically did city expansions in 2014, 15, 16, 17. We missed, we skipped one year because we took on another brand called generosity. And then 2019, we did our last market expansion and then pandemic felt like it's been a four years of, just white knuckling.

And now I think I'm back to, all right, what are we now? We're no longer an events model. Here we are.

[00:25:45] Jay: And so what is that? What are you now, what does the non-events model look like for you?

[00:25:49] Chris: Honestly, it's like back to basics in some sense for me, I almost feel like. The events were strategic in the 2010s, but so the barrier to entry was so low, so much a flood, helpfully of so many groups organizing so many events that was growing a lot in the late 2010s, we already saw the writing on the wall of like, do we want to be the best event?

No.

[00:26:12] Jay: Right.

[00:26:13] Chris: Cause it's not even what we're trying to be. I don't want to be an events producer. That's not what my career is. So we were already kind of retreating from that in the late 2010s. The pandemic made it easier. Cause then for 18 months, that business model was effectively illegal. So it felt like, all right, here's the chance to just totally run from that.

And so we went to like some basics, you know, we have advertising. We, people buy newsletter takeovers and, we do underwritten. I've pushed for a lot more. Financially supported journalism. So we've gone deeper, than some more philanthropy. Cause I wanted to, especially with an AI moment, I bet all the world on we'd have to go deeper and deeper.

and we do, we'll do like an annual conference still. So I think I'm betting a lot more on, I have to professionalize and go deeper and bigger and more national because I think so much of the local stuff will be able to fill, be filled by hobby projects. So like anything that people are doing for a hobby.

Or out of the goodness of their heart, if they can do it as well or nearly as well as I am, then I shouldn't be doing it because I don't, why am I paying people full time and getting healthcare benefits for someone who will do it for free? that's motivated me to say we have to specialize in deeper and more professional work.

So it's advertising, in a very traditional sense, just with new products.And some philanthropy, about a quarter philanthropy, a little less.

[00:27:36] Jay: Who would you consider your first customer? I know you

[00:27:40] Chris: I mean, literally right here 

[00:27:42] Jay: to ask, okay, is that the first dollar? 

[00:27:45] Chris: dollar. So I, may give her too much credit, but I always point out Tracy Wilson Rossman from chariot solutions. Bought the first ad. So this is a true story that in late 2009, we are, I was, or no, I think we actually made a list of people to call to advertise on our blog.

and I, truth is not faked. It always feels faked. we were so far off the mark. That we were like, Oh, a lot of entrepreneurs and tech workers go to bars. Maybe bars should advertise on our, on our website. So I remember calling like these, like Irish pubs and just cold calling them. And they'd be like, Hey, Kavanaugh's.

And I'd be like, is the manager there? And they'd be like, sure, what's going on? I'd be like, I want, to tell them about my website and whether you'd like to advertise specials. And so I did like 40 cold calls to bars. And obviously every one of them were like, what? No, I don't know. I don't want to advertise in your site at all.

and then we found this, small it consulting firm, chariot solutions and suburban Philadelphia that we covered sometimes. you know, advertise that they sold their services to people who are growing tech companies. and so we're like, Oh, I get it. You, it is valuable for you to be in front of our.

audience. You'll buy a 150 ad. Cool. and so I think Chariot and Tracy will always get credit for being the first 150

ad buy.

[00:29:14] Jay: super ironic. I was just emailing with Mike, yesterday

[00:29:19] Chris: There you go. Well, give give Mike my 

[00:29:21] Jay: good, good folks over there. all right. Well, we could probably talk for about six hours. We're going to wrap it. I have one question for you. That's non business related, non news related, maybe it's news related, but non business related. If you could do anything on earth, and you knew you wouldn't fail, what would it be?

[00:29:47] Chris: I'd probably be writing the right

[00:29:50] Jay: What does that mean?

[00:29:54] Chris: a book that matter and helped people do or understand a thing. My interest in journalism when distilled is that I like to try to figure out complex stuff and try to make it a little easier for other people to understand or engage with.

And so I love, I still, it's not my job anymore, but I still love writing a news article.

I still love trying to dig into something and make it simpler and more approachable. And I really respect fiction and nonfiction for that matter, because they're just different platforms, but, going long and big on a thing on a theme or a concept. And I read a ton of books. I so love that someone spent years of their life on a thing that in a couple of weeks, I can try to get their time and put it in my head.

So I, I admire it. so that, Will be a contribution. I hope to someday make

[00:30:56] Jay: Love that answer. I kind of want to do that too. We'll

[00:31:02] Chris: your wishes. My command

[00:31:04] Jay: We'll do it together.

Chris? You're a pillar of Philadelphia

[00:31:10] Chris: All right.

[00:31:11] Jay: respects. You are incredibly handsome. You're kind of tall. You run a news organization. You're, you know, happy, successful dad. people could just say that you have it all my friend.

And I think you do. I, you know, think I'm a little partial cause like I said, my mom, Ran the newspaper growing up. So

I think I feel a little bit of, you know, connection there to you, but honestly, man, one of the most. Genuinely cool people in the city, and I cannot thank you enough for your time. I want to have you back on.

Because I feel like we could talk more and more and more about stuff and maybe people care. Maybe they wouldn't. 

but. How do people find you directly if they want to reach out and say, hey, Chris, that thing you were talking about resonated with me. How do they reach out?

[00:31:54] Chris: My, email, it's just chris, at technical. ly Technical.ly. But, at the moment, the, social platform that I've migrated to after all of the social changes last few years is the LinkedIn. So the linkedin. com. 

[00:32:09] Jay: Someone said the other day, LinkedIn's having a moment, which I think is a true statement

[00:32:15] Chris: it's just not toxic. So everything gets clowned on for being kind of like overly earnest and a bunch of like business dweebs selling their stuff is almost it's charm because it is just very earnestly just people doing their thing. 

[00:32:32] Jay: it is what it is. 

[00:32:34] Chris: is. what it is. It's actually, that is a cliche. That is actually a hundred percent true.

It is exactly what it is.

[00:32:38] Jay: it is exactly what is on the box. And I think, you know, in, in some respects that's come back around to be appreciated. All right. Check out Technical.ly. T E C H N I C A L dot L Y

[00:32:50] Chris: We love those Libyan domains.

[00:32:52] Jay: I mean, did you have problems registering that in America?

[00:32:58] Chris: Not problems. We actually did in very reportedly fashion. we actually went really deep on wait, at this point we were, like, are we supporting the Qaddafi regime? So we did actually a bunch of reporting and I can would backstop it. And it was at a separate entity that was kind of licensed out.

let's talk to someone from Bitly who at that point was on a dot L Y. And we had like a little, dot L Y group meeting and we felt good about it. We do have backups if it all falls apart, but I can would backstop the dot L Y domain reporting in a business function 

[00:33:30] Jay: I love 

[00:33:31] Chris: the time.

[00:33:32] Jay: I love it. All right, buddy. Have a good rest of your week.

Have a good summer. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks Chris. See you, man. 

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